Show Notes
[00:00:00] Charna Cassell: So today's episode is very real, and my guest, Ruby Marez, is in Los Angeles where the fires are happening, and luckily she's safe and not in the evacuation zone. And her home is safe. And a number of my people, my close childhood friends, have lost their family homes. So, she originally cancelled our recording yesterday, but we got to talking.
[00:00:27] Charna Cassell: We ended up staying on the phone for over an hour. There's a lot of, , intersection and commonality in terms of our backgrounds in performing and play and use of humor in healing trauma and addressing trauma and using humor as a doorway into talking about trauma.
[00:00:49] Charna Cassell: And so while her work is really funny and playful, Some of this interview, because we're talking about her reaction, , what's actively occurring for her in the face of the fires that are actively still blazing. This may be, I just want to do a little bit of a trigger warning. If you're feeling dysregulated, , you could feel really mirrored by what she's sharing.
[00:01:16] Charna Cassell: There's also a lot of suggestions and practices that are going to be useful for how to address, , when your nervous system is feeling stressed out. So I hope this feels useful for you. My heart goes out to you if you're actively in a fire zone. I just really hope that you're safe and the process of rebuilding is unimaginable.
[00:01:40] Charna Cassell: So, and, and it's possible. So, uh, here is Ruby Marez, , otherwise known, known as a Ramón, and I hope you enjoy.
[00:01:50] Learn
[00:01:57] how to live embodied If it's about to unwind Uncover new tools and start healing Leave trauma and tension behind Isn't it great laid open Let all your desires come true How can you live laid open
[00:02:29] Imagine yourself brand new. Imagine yourself brand new.
[00:02:37] Charna Cassell: Hi, welcome back to Late Open Podcast. This is your host Charna Cassell and today's guest is Ruby Marez. Did I say that right?
[00:02:46] Ruby Marez: You did. Wow.
[00:02:47] Charna Cassell: Fabulous. So glad. Oh, so good to have you on. Welcome.
[00:02:52] Ruby Marez: A better, I'm having a better day than yesterday when we were supposed to chat. Yeah.
[00:02:57] Charna Cassell: Yeah. It's um, We're dealing with the fires in L.
[00:03:04] Charna Cassell: A. right now, and, uh, so it's, it's a lot. Yeah. you know, you're, you're in Los Angeles.
[00:03:12] Ruby Marez: Yeah.
[00:03:13] Charna Cassell: And navigating, you're, you're hosting some friends.
[00:03:17] Ruby Marez: Mm hmm. Yeah.
[00:03:18] Ruby Marez: Two
[00:03:19] Ruby Marez: left to go to Joshua Tree yesterday because they were just like, you know, the air isn't as bad where I am, but it's still like polluted and ashy and smoky and yuck.
[00:03:29] Ruby Marez: Like you have to wear a mask outside.
[00:03:30] Charna Cassell: Yeah, yeah.
[00:03:31] Ruby Marez: And my friend had just recovered from COVID. So she was like, I've already been inside for eight days. Like, I just need to be outside. And so yesterday when I was like, I have no bandwidth to talk, although then we ended up having a great phone conversation, 42 minutes, and it was like such good medicine for me yesterday.
[00:03:47] Ruby Marez: , basically what happened a lot yesterday, more fires were popping up. It's inconclusive if some of it was arson, which is upsetting. They were accidentally sending out to everybody in LA County, like 10 million people, an evacuation warning. So like over and over you're like, wait, what? I have to maybe evacuate?
[00:04:09] Ruby Marez: And then like 45 minutes are like, sorry, not for your area. And it woke me up twice while I was sleeping. I was like, please, like whoever's handling this, like, please gotta, please gotta hold on this because all of us are panicking. And then we don't get the like error message until 40 minutes later, or sometimes two hours later.
[00:04:27] Charna Cassell: No.
[00:04:27] Ruby Marez: up and alert, like, do I need to go? And then where do I go? And now there's fires and say, for me, there's fires to the south of me, to the east of me, to the north of me.
[00:04:37] Charna Cassell: Yes.
[00:04:38] Ruby Marez: So it's kind of like, where do I go?
[00:04:41] Charna Cassell: Well, and it's, I mean, so to give a little context, For our listeners, while you are a writer, an actress, a comedian, a clown, a drag king, you have this one person show, , and in that show, one of the things, yeah, Ramón!
[00:05:00] Charna Cassell: Hello. Yes. Some people are going to be listening and some people are going to be seeing your awesome t shirt, and getting to engage with Ramón. But one of the things that you, that you do in your show is you talk about the window of tolerance, which relates to nervous system regulation and you're educating people about the nervous system and wellness using play and comedy.
[00:05:25] Ruby Marez: Yeah. Yeah. Which is like
[00:05:27] Ruby Marez: so useful right now, even for me just to notice. I think a lot of it, they always say right in therapy, like the first key is noticing. So noticing like. My brain's been hijacked by fear. , I'm not able to totally connect to a feeling. I've had so many wonderful friends in state out of state be like, how are you doing?
[00:05:46] Ruby Marez: And I don't have a response. And so I've just been like, I don't know, like I'm on edge, but I know that's not a feeling, you know, that's more like a state. , or sometimes I'm like, okay, currently I'm feeling a lot of grief or I'm feeling devastated, but we're still in. The experience of wildfires happening all around us.
[00:06:06] Ruby Marez: So like, I'm not out of it to even, I'm just feeling like, Oh, I keep coming back to my body and then being disconnected and coming back and being disconnected. So noticing over and over, like getting it a message saying. evacuation warning. Of course, that makes me anxious, you know, and then getting one saying, Oh, not you.
[00:06:27] Ruby Marez: Sorry about that. That was an error. You're like, like, you're coming back down into a more regulated nervous system, but also then you're pissed. You're like, what dude?
[00:06:39] Charna Cassell: had to pack a go bag. I could see the fire from my house in Oakland earlier in, in, you know, a couple months ago.
[00:06:47] Charna Cassell: And, the panic of trying to collect your stuff. And so I can only imagine riding this insane roller coaster where you're getting those messages, and if you're waking up, you're completely disoriented.
[00:07:00] Ruby Marez: Yeah.
[00:07:01] Charna Cassell: In, in January, I had a home invasion and it was at four in the morning and, and so that time for, for a good portion of the year, it was like, even last night, actually my dog jumped off the bed and that was what had happened during the home invasion.
[00:07:18] Charna Cassell: So I immediately was like, is there something that I need to be alerted to? Yeah. Why isn't she just laying there sleeping? so the way that the, the nervous system can react so quickly, even, you know, beyond, before you can actually logically think about something, your body is having its reactions.
[00:07:36] Charna Cassell: So you're, you're educated about all this stuff. So you have this observer, but your body is still doing what it does.
[00:07:43] Ruby Marez: Yeah.
[00:07:44] Charna Cassell: Right.
[00:07:44] Ruby Marez: Yeah. And knowing like the practices I've come back to throughout this week is like tapping, you know, a lot of chest tapping to like get it out, shaking, doing horsey lips like, but even knowing like, Oh, I'm just doing like superficial scrapes, going to yoga, like doing it online.
[00:08:02] Ruby Marez: And then it's just a half mile from my house. So like going down there, , cause again, I'm not in a fire area or an evacuation zone where. South of it. , so having that going to meditation, I have little sound bowls doing that. Even being with my friend here, it's like helpful because you have somebody with you to like cry.
[00:08:21] Ruby Marez: There she is someone to cry with, or like to be confused about everything, you know, someone with you, but in terms of like nervous system states, I mean, I've noticed for myself so much this week, me going, and I'm such a like fight and flight person. And this week, because it wasn't totally happening. Where I was living, but nearby, I've just been in a free state because I had to evacuate four times in 2020 from fires alone.
[00:08:50] Ruby Marez: Then another time in 2020 due to a stalker who may or may not have gotten my location information and having to evacuate and go to his house in the woods. And then all last year, last January 3rd, My apartment flooded for the first time. And then there were subsequent floods, not from natural disaster from like bad pipes that my building refused to fix.
[00:09:15] Ruby Marez: And then we discovered I had mold and it was toxic mold, which explained why I was sick for that whole year before nobody could figure out why. And so I've been displaced and still am, , for over a year. I'm at my brother's place now. And so I relocated before I came to my brother's place like 10 times.
[00:09:31] Charna Cassell: Which is, you know, each, each repetition kind of is amplified by the previous experience.
[00:09:39] Ruby Marez: Yeah.
[00:09:40] Charna Cassell: And that's just, that's a lot. It's a lot. Really, really managed a lot. And, and that kind of bracing of when can I come down from this? And, or do I have to still be on alert when you're getting those notifications?
[00:09:53] Charna Cassell: That's,
[00:09:55] Ruby Marez: And also, you know, grieving for everybody that's lost their homes and their things and knowing exactly how that feels because, you know, the entire time this whole mold thing was going on because they said at first it was only one part of my apartment and you're out of your home, your thought is, I'm going to be able to return to my own bed one day.
[00:10:14] Ruby Marez: And then I came home several months later and realized the mold was everywhere and it had eaten up a chunk of my bed. Like, it had gone through the walls and eaten my bed. So, like, that devastation, like, my favorite, the thing that we need most, sleep, and my favorite bed ever is now completely filled with mold and, like, all that hope is gone and having to throw out all your furniture, like, it's just so painful because, not like I'm prioritizing stuff, but, You know, but it's also like, I worked so hard to have a home and everything was secondhand and from friends that were moving and donated, even that bed was like a donation from my friend.
[00:10:48] Ruby Marez: It was a California King bed, which was like, Oh my God, what luxury to be able to roll around. You know? So that grief and that loss of like, You don't have a home anymore. You don't have drill the drawers that your partner like put beautiful stenciling on, you know, like all those things, not the things so much.
[00:11:07] Ruby Marez: It's like, Your stability has been taken away from you from actions that you haven't even done and then the insurance company's not fulfilling anything and dragging you along and I feel so much for everybody that's going through it because It's just so intense one day in your bed and the next moment you don't have it which is so threatening to our nervous system I mean housing is everything for us Even for, for all animals, for bears, for deers.
[00:11:40] Ruby Marez: But if we don't feel a state of like safe home, we can never really come back into our body and be united with our brain in a regulated way because we're on high alert. So definitely it's been a week of feeling hijacked, you know, and, and not like shaming myself, just, you know, having that ability to see like, wow, I am really out of.
[00:12:05] Ruby Marez: wits.
[00:12:07] Charna Cassell: Well, and I, I think what's important to say is like, no matter how much you could be a neuroscientist, right. It doesn't matter how much you have studied or know about the nervous system. I, you know, I've, I've been doing my own personal work and, and studied this and, and had a private practice for over 20 years.
[00:12:26] Charna Cassell: Is it, does that, I'm still a human, right? You're going to be impacted. And we have cycles of revisiting, even no matter how healed we are, we have cycles where we revisit and get a little closer to the core trauma we've previously experienced to move through it with, with new resources and more resources, hopefully.
[00:12:47] Charna Cassell: Yeah. And so. It's hard when it's like the first time you're addressed, like, let's say you have a lot of unaddressed material and then you encounter something. It's the first cycle of going through and into your trauma and how it's stored in the body and what the felt experience is and processing all of that.
[00:13:07] Charna Cassell: So it's a lot. It's a lot if you've done it before. Yes. And this is your second round or third round or fourth round. And it's a lot the first time. And so, you know, um, I have definitely been thinking about friends who've, who've lost their homes in previous fires because of course, how can it not get activated?
[00:13:28] Charna Cassell: And I was thinking about you and, um, and so then it's a matter of, well, what do we, there's, we, we talked yesterday actually about anticipatory grief. Yeah. And that, that article that I wrote, , And that is something it's like sitting in the bracing for there's grief of what has been lost and then there's grief of like, I don't even I don't know what could be lost and how to be with that, how to how to be with that kind of frozen bracing state.
[00:14:00] Ruby Marez: Yeah, I've just been for me this week doing like This sounds so, this is so me, like, hyper cleaning as a way of maintaining control of my life. I did have multiple loads of laundry to do, just because the way the past few weeks have unfolded. Um, but being like, now's a good time to clean our makeup brushes.
[00:14:21] Ruby Marez: Um, you know, or like, now's a good time to organize this cabinet. Mm hmm. Micro.
[00:14:28] Charna Cassell: Getting into the, like, like, Let me organize my socks by color. Let me purge my pantry.
[00:14:36] Ruby Marez: I could floss twice a day. I don't think there's a rule against that, right? You know, um, and I mean, like, if I can do anything every day that would feel good.
[00:14:45] Ruby Marez: For me, it's, it's yoga. And that's always been When I was sick from toxic mold, I wasn't able to because I was so ill, I was just like in bed and very, very ill. And so that was probably when I was at my lowest. Um, and oddly, this sounds so weird when I, and for anybody listening, when like your body's so ill, you can't move.
[00:15:07] Ruby Marez: The only thing that did help me a bit other than seeing some comedy shows on TV that were just like, You know, a nice distraction was listening to music because I could at least like be in bed on my back and like move my arms a little bit, you know, um, and it helped give me energy and I listened to the ACD song Thunderstruck a lot last year because I was like, I need the energy from this song for my body so I can heal and so I can like sue my landlords.
[00:15:41] Ruby Marez: You know, and the building manager. So like I kept listening to his way, like pump myself up, even though I get, I mean, I was in bed so many weeks last year, so ill. And like, there's not still a Western approach to dealing with toxic mold. So you're not, you're navigating all of that. And also feeling like this sucks.
[00:16:00] Ruby Marez: I can't really talk about my experience because I know I'm going to sue. And my lawyer was like, You know, don't mention too much about this online,
[00:16:08] Charna Cassell: even
[00:16:08] Ruby Marez: though posting about it before I got a lawyer was exactly how I got my lawyer. Like a friend online saw my post and gave it to me. That reference to me because they had to sue their landlord.
[00:16:19] Ruby Marez: And so I say all this to be like, when I was really in bed and sick, and I was like, if I could do anything, like with this information, what would I do? And it was like, I'm going to create a show as Ramón talking about this experience, informing other people. About their rights, you know, their housing rights in Los Angeles, um, what you can do if you have mildew or mold in your apartment, what your landlord legally has to do, because it took me months to find this out.
[00:16:45] Ruby Marez: And I was like, what if I could shortcut it and have the person that I worked with that was a mold and mildew expert, Zerita Jones, shout out to her. , and she's a housing advocate and, . If I could create a show and she comes on the show and informs people about all of this. And then I'll feel like not only did I, no matter what, like my art is here for me, my art will help me overcome everything.
[00:17:11] Ruby Marez: But then I'm giving back to and helping other people. And there were about seven people in my show when we did the show this summer. That last year in June of 2024, and every episode was a new expert talking about something else. , so the first one was Dorita Jones talking about mold and mildew and how to fight back with your landlords.
[00:17:29] Ruby Marez: Advocate for yourself, policies that are in place, numbers to call, and she had a whole PDF and then we, you know, posted it. on my Instagram. And then the next one was somebody that worked in a community garden and that was a place I went to help heal my lungs and to get like good nutrient dense soil like in my body because that's one of the things the naturopath said for me to heal my lungs and expose to toxic molds to be around good soil.
[00:17:55] Ruby Marez: And so she came and talked about like how to join or start a community garden that you don't have to have any knowledge or like skills like people will help you navigate all this. And then the third person, her name is Elisa Paracio, and she teaches, it's mostly women, but for men too, like how to come back to your body and like experience sensuality and pleasure and how to move your hips and release trauma from your hips.
[00:18:19] Ruby Marez: So those were all three people that I sought out while I was ill and recovering and activities I sought out, you know, , and getting really informed about housing rights. So I was like, I'm going to make a show, I'm going to bring these experts on, and every show I'm going to come out to the song Thunderstruck, because it's going to remind me of my power.
[00:18:42] Charna Cassell: So you did it. And it's, , I want to get more into how you originally came up with Ramón and, uh, you know, and, and, and why specifically that show, because that's a different show than all of this. Like that was already established. , the, the Ramón show, Spiritual Cheerleading 101 is the show that I'm familiar with.
[00:19:02] Ruby Marez: Yes. That was the first show I did as Ramón in 2022.
[00:19:06] Charna Cassell: And, and so then these ones have happened since. And so this is an, this is an alter ego really for you. This is a character that lives in you and, and keeps teaching different things.
[00:19:16] Ruby Marez: Yes.
[00:19:17] Charna Cassell: Yeah.
[00:19:18] Ruby Marez: As we evolve our alter egos evolve.
[00:19:21] Charna Cassell: Well, facilitating. So, so first let's talk a little bit about, spiritual cheerleading 101 and the material that you, like, what was your intention behind that particular show?
[00:19:34] Charna Cassell: What did you want to convey to people?
[00:19:36] Ruby Marez: Well, you know, it's funny. I call Ramón, like, my higher consciousness. And it's also, and I'll briefly share, like, I, I loved drag. But I was not someone that was, like, seeking it out to do it for myself. I just loved going to drag shows and found them such high energy.
[00:19:52] Ruby Marez: And I moved to LA and I was, you know, trying to make friends. And a friend invited me to their friend's drag roller skating party. And I was like, oh, okay. Okay. Like, what do I do? And she's like, you just. Like just dress up as a dude. And I was like, okay. And so I went to my storage unit, had like a wig from an old costume, this like red floral shirt with cutoff arms, boxer shorts with like the Superman logo on it, you know, purple tights.
[00:20:20] Ruby Marez: And then he's like psychedelic mushroom socks. I put it on, I put the mustache on my car, do my brows, wig is on. And I looked in the mirror and I was like, pretty good. And like that voice came to me and I was like, okay, I don't know what that is. And I first called him Raul. Because, you know, my mustache was like Raul Julia from The Addams Family, who's also Puerto Rican, and my mom went to school with him.
[00:20:41] Ruby Marez: And then I was like, no, Ruby, get your own name. So then Ramón eventually came. But, so I walked out of my car, going to this drag roller skating party. In 2017, and it was the first time I'd experienced no men staring at me as I walked on the street because they thought I was a dude. And I walked with like the swagger of John Travolta from Saturday Night Fever.
[00:21:04] Ruby Marez: And that feeling of not being stared at like you're a prey, you know, was so empowering and new. And I was like, Oh my God, is this what it's like to be a man?
[00:21:16] Ruby Marez: You
[00:21:16] Ruby Marez: just get to walk freely without being harassed or living in fear. This is so powerful. I want to, whatever this is, I'm going to do more of this.
[00:21:27] Ruby Marez: I went to the track roller skating party, and as it happened, there was a producer for comedy, Tence, and productions for music festivals at that party. And they thought Ramón was a character I'd already been doing. They took like my first photographs as him, you know, where I was like, widespreading and like, you know, just so full of confidence.
[00:21:50] Ruby Marez: And they booked me a few months later for a music festival. And in the, we had a comedy tent there and they asked me, do you have any material? About inner child work and leading up to that. I had started to develop Ramón as a character. I was auditioning him around town And doing like what I now I'm calling like gentle masculinity work So I was like, you know what the world does not need is another Like womanizer another person putting women down another person using people like I want to be the kind of guy I want to see in the world the kind of guy I'd like to date You know,, and starting to do improv based somatic exercises, you know, and doing research on that.
[00:22:31] Ruby Marez: And also just, you know, improv, you learn so many different games. And for me doing improv for well over a decade, like it just completely helped me navigate. What do I do in this unknown? How do I even have conversations with strangers? How do I put myself out there? So even if people do improv without the desire to perform it as, you know, a comedian or to take it into doing sketch or being a writer, the life skills, it gives you the way that you end up learning how to listen to people deeply, you know, like all those skills are really important for our social interactions and for us to be able to listen to ourselves.
[00:23:10] Ruby Marez: And listen to our bodies and notice like, Oh, my character, um, is emotionally reactive every time this character does this. What meaning am I making of it, you know, and translating that to our own experiences. So I started doing inner child exercises and, and affirmations, but not in like a hokey way, because a lot of those things can be done in such a, like, not effective hokey way that I was like, no, like, let me find a way to make it fun and interesting, especially for festival crowds.
[00:23:41] Ruby Marez: Like the attention span is, It's short, depending on the day, sometimes the drug or alcohol use is heightened. And so you really have to like reel them in quickly, you know, and like engage with them and make it real and not like fake. And so I was doing all this, what I now know are somatic exercise, but I was just called them improv exercises to engage audiences, , and it went really well and I kept getting asked back.
[00:24:08] Ruby Marez: And for me, it was, it was healing Ruby at the same time. You know, because I'm, I'm definitely way more shy than Ramón, you know, , it gave me confidence to ask for bigger paydays as Ramón, you know, and negotiate my contracts. Even as him, you know, I'll be like, Oh, I see that you're paying this guy a thousand dollars for the festival.
[00:24:31] Ruby Marez: So I should also get a thousand, right. You know, and like not being a defensive, but just. Making the case and being my own advocate having like an outside voice and advocate for myself, you know, , so spiritual cheerleading 101 that got developed during the pandemic. I started doing what I would call like deep therapy.
[00:24:54] Ruby Marez: In June of 2020. And it was just sparked by like how anxious I felt all the time and how reactive I felt. And I, I got into a fight with a friend, a dear friend. And for me, I was the first time I heard a therapist say, um, the 80, 20 rule. So like, I'm reacting to this person as if they're 80 percent of that pain, but that 80 percent of that pain happened in my childhood.
[00:25:19] Ruby Marez: And they're just triggering it at like 20%. But because I haven't processed that from my childhood. It's feeling like so much bigger. And then learning about the anger iceberg and how, you know, when we're angry, that's like the secondary feeling. And underneath that is deep sadness and grief that hasn't been processed.
[00:25:40] Ruby Marez: So all these like, And I'd been in therapy several times for different things, for navigating breakups, for dealing with hoarding, like all these other areas in my life. But this was like the first time I was learning about feelings. And I remember she would start our therapy sessions being like, how do you feel?
[00:25:56] Ruby Marez: And I'd, you know, I'd say something like, like I want to take a chainsaw and cut down stuff. And she'd be like, that's not a feeling. I'd be like, all right, all right, all right, all right, let me think about another feeling. I want to throw a plate against a wall. She's like, that's not a feeling. You know, cause like all I knew were like actions that I felt internally, but not like the actual feeling.
[00:26:19] Charna Cassell: But those are, but what's interesting about that, right? Is that you could go, okay, so that's, that's an image of, of what you're feeling. What are the sensations that accompany the desire to cut down on something or the sensations that, uh, that accompany wanting to throw a plate? What's the temperature of that?
[00:26:37] Charna Cassell: What's the texture of that? What's, when else have you felt that? Yes! Right? And then it's like, here are the, you know, clear emotions, do do do do do, which one do you feel more? You know? Um, mad, sad, glad, afraid, or disgusted? Right? And so, that's great. But, and you, you also, who's your ideal audience? Because I'm, you've mentioned festivals, but I've seen clips of you working with kids, and I really loved, you know, when you, when you had them going in and out, you had, I audience participation, which I think is an incredibly useful, , tool in doing educational theater.
[00:27:13] Charna Cassell: , it looked like kids from the audience and you were having them stand in the window. You're like, if you, if you have them, you know, you're talking to your dad, where are you? Are you in your window? Are you over here? Are you feeling, you know, dysregulated? And it seemed like I was like, Oh my God, can you imagine if this was in all high schools, how useful that would be?
[00:27:34] Ruby Marez: Yeah. You know, my ideal audience. Oh, and I should, I should go back and say Spiritual Cheerleading 101 basically came from the pandemic. Me learning all these, I took like four to five trauma informed classes online with like Gabor Mate and Peter Levine and like all these heavyweights in trauma circles learning more techniques that I then adapted for Spiritual Cheerleading 101.
[00:27:59] Ruby Marez: And then I brought that show for the, you know, I created it for the Hollywood Fringe Festival in 2022 because I won a scholarship. And I was like, this is a way for me to not away, but like outside of festival world into a mass audience, a theater going audience, because that group might be more also willing, like a festival crowd is, to interact and participate and learn different.
[00:28:23] Ruby Marez: Nervous system regulation skills, and I never say those words in the show. Yeah. If you say those words, like, even I would be like, I don't know what the fuck you're talking about, if I hadn't done the kind of work I'd done. So I just say, what makes you feel good? What makes you feel anxious? Because people understand that language.
[00:28:39] Ruby Marez: Right. And saying like, you know, the only way through is through. So like, I also don't like dealing with my feelings. I think it's annoying. It's annoying. But it's also, unless it's joy, and then I'm here for that one. But like, the only way to get through sadness is to be with it and nurture it and love it up, because if you push it down, it's just going to pop off in some other way.
[00:29:00] Ruby Marez: Through the Hollywood Fringe Festival, all kinds of age ranges, And types came to my show. some were children, some were older adults, I mean like 70s, 80s. , some were people who, , had different disabilities, neurodivergence, physical disabilities. And I know I'm not supposed to say like, this show is for everyone.
[00:29:19] Ruby Marez: But it does, I am able to grasp a wide range of people because all of us have feelings. Thanks.
[00:29:26] Charna Cassell: Well, we all have a, we all have a nervous system. We all have a nervous system. Honestly, I mean, I, I created a course. And I, it was a 12 module course and of that, I was like, if I was to take one mini thing and teach, if I could, if I, if I had to die tomorrow and I could teach one thing to all of humanity, what would it be?
[00:29:47] Charna Cassell: And it's, it is, how do we be with our emotions and our sensations to live a more joyful, peaceful existence and, and, and impact people with more, you know, have more accountability over. our internal state so that we don't have negative impacts.
[00:30:06] Ruby Marez: Yeah. And tools so you're not being like
[00:30:10] Charna Cassell: batted around and yeah, controlled by your emotions.
[00:30:13] Charna Cassell: And so, and honestly that's what it was. And, and, and so, you know, it is a universal need that we have.
[00:30:20] Ruby Marez: Yes, and it's universal education that I do, I do want to bring this to all schools and age ranges. , I've mostly been bringing it to festivals, wellness centers for adults because the truth is like younger kids.
[00:30:34] Ruby Marez: are still with their inner child and playful and the group that has lost the most amount of play and I think disconnection from their body or is adults and the age range that feels like it captures that in between place so perfectly as college students and when I've done my shows for colleges I mean that energy is like so high you know and the ability for them to like Same with festivals, like participate and want to interact and want to heal.
[00:31:05] Ruby Marez: It's immediate. I don't have to do a lot of coaxing. And I think college students are way more informed than I was about the nervous system and emotions and regulation. And so like it doesn't take that long to get them on board. I would say like they're pretty hungry for it and it's really fulfilling because they're I would say like college started to become the time where like, I could feel like I'm not able to escape all the pain that I feel the way that I was when I was younger.
[00:31:33] Ruby Marez: And it just kept stacking. I started to feel more depression. I started to feel more numbness. You know, when I learned in 2020 about disassociation, I had a moment of like, wait, what? That's not what we're supposed to be doing all the time. I would describe 95 percent of my life disassociated and the 5 percent that wasn't, it was me on stage.
[00:31:53] Ruby Marez: That's
[00:31:53] Charna Cassell: Well, you're being, I mean, what you were saying about improv and what it does is it's actually asking you to be so present in the present moment, as you said, listening to others and yourself. And so often if we're either dissociated, we're not in ourselves or we're socially anxious beings observing and criticizing and not being in the present moment.
[00:32:15] Ruby Marez: Yeah.
[00:32:16] Charna Cassell: Right. So you're in performing, you're like. Yeah.
[00:32:20] Ruby Marez: And it's the only time I could really feel sensations in my body. Cause I would, I mean, I still not as Ramóne, which is funny sometimes as Ramóne, but not as intensely, but still as myself Ruby for improv show specifically, I feel that anxiety. The entire day of the show and that dread for like 15 years.
[00:32:40] Ruby Marez: This is a sentence I say before every show. This is the last time we do this. This is the last time we perform. I hate this feeling. We're never promised me. We'll never do this again. I'm like, I promise. Yeah. And then five seconds after I'm on stage, I'm like, fine. I don't know what that was about.
[00:32:55] Charna Cassell: I did a one woman show 25 years ago and, and it was about, I was telling you a little bit that it was about healing from sexual trauma using somatic work and my working at Good Vibrations, which is a worker owned sex toy store and the boundary crossings that happened there that would spark memories from childhood and, um, moving through all, all of that.
[00:33:17] Charna Cassell: And. But before I would go on stage, I would totally get diarrhea. My nervous system was like, you know, I'd have to like pee 17 times. I would have to poop anything that I ate out. And then as soon as, and I would feel the dread, I would, you know, my girlfriend at the time, I'd be like under blankets and be crying, don't make me do this.
[00:33:40] Charna Cassell: And she's like, you don't have to. And I'm like, yeah, well, I do. Yeah. And. And it's, it's amazing. And so even with, again, with that awareness, that doesn't mean you don't go out of your window, but I could meditate my way out of, or like do somatic grounding practices, get myself on stage, and then once I was there, I'd be like, oh, these are not my enemies, I'm not going to die.
[00:34:05] Charna Cassell: You know, but I literally had physical somatic practices. Yes. I had to do, be, in order to breathe my way onto that stage.
[00:34:13] Ruby Marez: God, I wish I'd had, I mean, if I could go back in time and do anything differently, it would be having these tools in my twenties and thirties and I, I honestly don't know how I did anything without them.
[00:34:24] Ruby Marez: And now as an actor, you know, because I'm so focused on Ramón and having Ramón. Have his own TV show and like do all these things that I see form and go to colleges. It's been my main focus. So I've taken like there's just so many hours in a day. So I haven't been promoting myself as much. Yeah. But I'm still, you know, I'm shooting commercial Monday.
[00:34:44] Ruby Marez: I shot a commercial a few months ago or a few weeks ago. So I'm still acting but like. My anxiety around auditioning is just kind of, it's so low now
[00:34:56] Ruby Marez: because I'm
[00:34:56] Ruby Marez: like, whatever, love me or hate me. I don't know. I don't care. Like. And I, maybe it's because I went so, so much like juice. I'm saying all that juice for Ramón, the Ramón show, but I'm like, everything that's meant for me comes my way.
[00:35:11] Ruby Marez: And whatever it's not meant for me, doesn't come my way. And I wish I had that in my twenties and thirties, because it was such a, you know, looking back so painful and like that need for validation, because when you're, it's like, the reason auditioning is so hard is because you're trying to get a job for money.
[00:35:28] Ruby Marez: to survive and you've put all this money in training and you do it all the time. You get, you see, you receive rejection over and over and over. And I used to take it so personally, like I suck. And then I started producing works and being in the casting office and they would just be like, we don't want someone with brown hair.
[00:35:48] Charna Cassell: Yeah.
[00:35:49] Ruby Marez: And I'd be like, but they were amazing. Who cares what color hair? It's a toothpaste commercial. No one at home is going to care. They were fantastic. But they're like, no, we envision somebody blonde. You know, so then that's what we'd be casting is somebody blonde, even though we called in all these brunettes.
[00:36:04] Ruby Marez: And you're like, Oh, is that how it works?
[00:36:06] Charna Cassell: Well, what's what's crazy is that is, is that it also relates to relationships outside of acting in jobs because people, you know, it so much is not personal. Right.
[00:36:18] Ruby Marez: So much is not personal.
[00:36:19] Charna Cassell: So much
[00:36:19] Charna Cassell: is not personal. So it's a useful tool Yeah. To have in all aspects of life.
[00:36:24] Ruby Marez: Yeah. Especially when someone reacts in a way that you're like. You know, for anybody that's been dating, like whatever level of tools this person has coming into the relationship, like that's what they got. And maybe they'll gain more and you guys can work on it together. Like that's always the goal and the hope, but when I've had moments where I'm like, Oh, my partner's not able to be there for me.
[00:36:46] Ruby Marez: I'm also able to see like, Oh, they're not able to be there for themselves. In these moments either, like, it's not like I'm the only one not receiving support. Like they can't even support themselves in that feeling. So it's not personal. Like they don't have that skill set yet and God love them. And also God love me.
[00:37:07] Ruby Marez: And this might not be the right relationship for me if that's what's up.
[00:37:13] Charna Cassell: I wish we could keep talking because there's so much that we actually covered in our, our conversation yesterday, but I know we need to start to wrap up, unfortunately. And I, oh, you know what I was going to add? Tell me, tell me.
[00:37:26] Ruby Marez: In spiritual cheerleading, we, you know, 101, the Ramón show, the first Ramón show that I did.
[00:37:32] Ruby Marez: The five feelings I covered was anxiety, judgment, or anger, anxiety, judgment, sadness, happiness, and we have fear in there, but the show is just like a little too long. And I was like, well, we can put ideas of fear and anxiety and judgment because that's Also where fears come and anger too, right? Like I am angry at leaf blowers because they're bad for the environment.
[00:37:54] Ruby Marez: And I feel fear about the climate, you know, like their fear is very interrelated to all of that. , and so we reduced it to five and I created my own feelings wheel because so many feelings, feelings, wheel of many people's is so big that for me, it overwhelms me. And I was like, how do I reduce this in a simple way that also like.
[00:38:15] Ruby Marez: These are the five emotions you will probably experience on a weekly basis, if not daily, you know, but really feeling, , that those are the, and like, they're the easiest to access in your head, because even if people aren't able to somatically feel everything, They can intellectually be like, I know what anger is, I, like, I know where to feel at my body, I know what anxiety feels like, I know what judgment feels like, you know, so I picked the five that were the most relatable and, concrete. Then the last thing I was going to say was for anybody at home, if you struggle with speaking kindly to yourself, consider creating an alter ego. Like I did, because all the therapy I did did not totally help me knock out my inner critic, you know, and I've done EMDR, I've done ketamine therapy, I've done mushroom therapy, like, but that tape is so well worn in the brain.
[00:39:10] Ruby Marez: And I was like, I need something to balance it and then like replace it in a way.
[00:39:16] Ruby Marez: So
[00:39:16] Ruby Marez: having, you know, If I had to create the most loving, supportive voice in my head, what would they sound like? How would they speak to me? Or even like what kind of partner or best friend do I want in my life? And that can be your higher consciousness, alter ego creation that lives inside of you.
[00:39:34] Ruby Marez: And then you always have a loving, supportive, positive voice talking to you. Because for me, it was too hard for me to like, say it as myself, you know, but having Ramón say it like, I think we're being really hard on ourselves. We're doing our best, you know, like,
[00:39:49] Charna Cassell: yeah. Yeah.
[00:39:50] Ruby Marez: And he's Puerto Rican and I'm Puerto Rican.
[00:39:51] Ruby Marez: So that's why that accent's there. , but having another voice in my head helped me, um, not fall victim to the inner critic voice, which had my voice for a long time, you know? And so now we're, I don't know, seven years in almost, uh, like six and a half.
[00:40:08] Charna Cassell: And
[00:40:09] Ruby Marez: that inner critic is getting smaller and smaller.
[00:40:11] Ruby Marez: And when they pop up, it's not like I'm like, shut up, you know? I'm just like, Oh, wow. Like, I'm being really hard on myself, I wonder what that's about. And that, and Ramón will say that.
[00:40:20] Charna Cassell: Mm hmm. Yeah. So there's this, I mean, you know, your, your alter ego gets to be someone who's in your corner. Also, the use of humor breaks up energetically, just like shifts things.
[00:40:35] Charna Cassell: And so Ramón sounds, you know, there's, there's humor, but there's also a lot of kindness. Like you said, you wanted to create someone you'd want to date.
[00:40:43] Ruby Marez: Yeah.
[00:40:44] Charna Cassell: You
[00:40:44] Charna Cassell: know? And then it's like, almost like a positive dad figure in a way that's in your head. That's like, you know, some of us didn't grow up with that.
[00:40:53] Charna Cassell: Yes. And, and sometimes, you know, people don't even know how to talk to themselves kindly. They have, have so little experience with it. It's something that I have to help them like model what that even looks like. So there may be some necessary research or movies or books to read in order to figure out like, what would that alter ego be?
[00:41:14] Ruby Marez: Yeah, and it's not like I was like Even totally aware when I was creating Ramón, but I knew I loved Gomez Adams from the Adams family, the route with Julia version. I was like, I love that dude. And like, I would want a day to do it like that. That's just like so infatuated with me and kisses my arm and hand up and down and praises me and would do anything for me, you know, and it's like.
[00:41:38] Ruby Marez: It wasn't totally conscious. That's how I built it. But it has appeared to be like, Oh, that's so cool. a lot of what we extracted and started to build Ramóna's, you know, and even when I talk as Ramóna, it's different than how I talk, you know, and that feels really interesting, especially on a neurological level, like, Oh, that's how you like brain hack.
[00:41:59] Ruby Marez: your own inner critic.
[00:42:00] Charna Cassell: So there's, there's two resources there that are more getting more commonly known. I'll put out there, which is feeding your demons is a more spiritual approach to parts work, which is super useful. And I've seen dramatic shifts, even doing one session with a client in introducing this kind of work with them.
[00:42:19] Charna Cassell: And then, you know, IFS internal family systems is getting much more popular, but any kind of trauma work. Good trauma work involves working with different parts of us.
[00:42:28] Ruby Marez: Yes.
[00:42:28] Charna Cassell: And having compassion for the parts that we may have historically had disdain for. , like the critic is just trying to protect you and take care of you.
[00:42:36] Charna Cassell: Right? In the way that it knows how. The fearful worrier, I have a big worrier part of me. Right? It's like, how do we be with those parts? But I also really love, it's like, what is that part? What is it? Where? How does it move? And you described. That, you know, Ramón's drawn Travolta swagger confidence and the level of safety in that body that's not being watched and groped and, you know, constantly is so important.
[00:43:05] Charna Cassell: So imagining it's like, then you have a felt sense of. Oh, well, this is what it actually feels like to move in the world as this being, and how do I keep every rehearsal reinforces that. And so that you're literally, you're, you're supporting the muscle memory of what it's like to have, to be in a kind, warm, you know, uh, safe body.
[00:43:29] Ruby Marez: Yes. Yes. And they do say that. Play and comedy are like two of the most proven methods for dealing with trauma,
[00:43:39] Ruby Marez: you
[00:43:39] Ruby Marez: know, because both of them involved, like if you're able to laugh, not like the nervous laugh that we all know about when like we got in trouble at school, or like with our boss, we like giggle out of like, I'm trying to like regulate, but like, real connection, humor connection and play because it requires not only your nervous system to be like regulated enough, but it's like a little, it's not a little, it's a portal outside of yourself.
[00:44:05] Ruby Marez: This, you know, like life can feel like it's so in from your face and intense and then to be able to play or laugh like it's zoomed out enough and that you can, for me especially Ramón was like, this is another version of myself that does exist within, within me. And he's my portal to it. And so when I presented Ramón to Peter Levine, he's like, I think this is great.
[00:44:29] Ruby Marez: This is like the kind of therapy you can do on your own all the time. And I love parts work and I love IFS and I'm doing that with my therapist now. And it's so effective at being like, even like what, how old, how old is that voice that's saying like,
[00:44:45] Ruby Marez: we
[00:44:46] Ruby Marez: don't have enough,
[00:44:47] Ruby Marez: you know,
[00:44:48] Ruby Marez: or, um, naming like, Oh, that's critical.
[00:44:51] Ruby Marez: Calvin. Constantly telling me I'm not up to good, that I suck, again. Boy, he's really worried about my future, you know? And then, like you said, naming them, what do they wear, , being able, I call it like tracking who's at the table. And like how much credence do I give each one of them? But mostly what's underneath that is they're just worried and want me to stay alive.
[00:45:17] Charna Cassell: Yeah.
[00:45:19] Ruby Marez: How loving.
[00:45:20] Charna Cassell: Well, and so along those lines, does, does Ramón have any parting words related to, you know, how, like if there are people out there listening and still worried about the fires and how to navigate that. And, and also how can people find you separately? He can answer that too.
[00:45:39] Ruby Marez: Okay, cool. He's Ramón right now.
[00:45:41] Ruby Marez: , I would say connect with your community as much as you can, whether it's through Instagram, FaceTime calls. That's what I've been doing is having phone calls with friends, Zooms, um, and sharing like what's on my heart, what's on my mind and being with the feeling. instead of talking myself out of the feeling because it's such a heightened time, you know, so give permission to any feeling that arrives and don't put yourself down for having that feeling, you know, as, uh, somebody said, this musician said at the workshop I was at last month, he said, every wave has a break.
[00:46:23] Ruby Marez: And I love that sentence. You know, it lives in that same space of these two shall pass. And I'm still in some version of housing instability, but I do have a roof over my head. I do have a place I can shower and sleep and feel safe at. I just don't have my own place right now because I got displaced from my situation.
[00:46:43] Ruby Marez: But the intensity of it has passed. You know, so every wave has a break and the more we can be there for one another. I think it's the best medicine, mutual aid, community support. We save us, you know, we cannot rely on our governments to help us or save us. It's us helping us. And I have seen that the amount of support I have seen from people in state and out of state, the way LA is rallying together, it's so beautiful.
[00:47:12] Ruby Marez: And I always say to people, I think there's amazing people in Los Angeles. I don't, I don't, um, have any negative experiences of the people here. I think they're tremendous and seeing our spirit really rise in the support and people doing donations and food runs. You can go to my, uh, Instagram at Ramón loves you and I have different links for space and places people can donate.
[00:47:38] Ruby Marez: And so to answer your other question, my website is www.theRamónshow.com. And my Instagram is at, Ramón Loves you. So don't give up on each other.
[00:47:50] Ruby Marez: We're all we got. And don't give up on the planet. It's here for us.
[00:47:56] Charna Cassell: Thank you, Ramón. I'm wondering if there's an exercise or some kind of practice that Ramón would love to guide our listeners through.
[00:48:07] Ruby Marez: Yes. So I'm like, Oh, do I do the judgment one or the anger one?
[00:48:11] Ruby Marez: Which one do I do? I'm going to do judgment right now. And if we have time, I do anger. So basically, what's a judgment you have about yourself? that you're ready to let go of. You know, it has to be something that you're really not 100 percent ready to let go of, but maybe you're like at least 10 percent in on wanting to let go of, you know, so it could be any kind of judgment you're having with yourself.
[00:48:35] Ruby Marez: So for me, my example is I used to drop things on the floor a lot, you know, kind of butterfingers and I would scream it to myself when I would drop them. I'd say, God damn it, you idiot. And then one time my roommate heard me and she said, what's wrong? And I was like, Oh, nothing. And he just like dropped a fork on the floor.
[00:48:59] Ruby Marez: And she said all of that for a fork, you know? And I felt so embarrassed to even tell her why I screamed at myself because a part of me knew, like, that was too much. But when she said that, all that for a fork, I realized how harsh I was being with myself. You know, I never signed a contract saying I wouldn't drop things on the floor.
[00:49:19] Ruby Marez: So now when I drop something on the floor, I say like, oopsie poopsie, you know, or like, I meant to do that, or time for a calf stretch, you know, and I stretch my calves out and I grab the item. And interesting enough, I hardly drop things now because I'm not screaming at myself to be perfect, to never drop anything.
[00:49:39] Ruby Marez: And so what the exercise is, is writing down something you're ready to let go of, a judgment. If we were at a fire pit with a fire marshal, I would say we would light it on fire. Please don't do that unless you have those two things happening in your life. Instead, once you write it down, you can, in ceremony, shred it, you know, or you can shred it and then put it down the toilet, flush it down the toilet, you know, and then write on another piece of paper, a post it note, your new supportive, loving thought you're going to say in its place, right?
[00:50:15] Ruby Marez: So for me, I would say, oopsie poopsie. Or, I meant to do that. Or time for a calf stretch. So what's the new loving, kind thought you're going to say to yourself in place of that judgment? And then you put that post it note somewhere where you can see it every day. Maybe your bathroom mirror. Maybe on the milk that you use for your coffee or mate.
[00:50:35] Ruby Marez: You know, somewhere where you can see it. So you start recording that new thought to yourself, you know, another example I gave is I wrote to myself, what would it be like to live for one day without judging myself? And so that entire day I started collecting the judgments. I had about myself, not to shame myself, just to see like, Oh, what's in there?
[00:50:55] Ruby Marez: What I, what I yelling at myself about, you know? And so I saw those judgments and then from there I could pick, okay, this is one of the ones I'm going to work on for the next week. This is my new loving kind thought in place of that negative judgment. And, you know, I tell people why this is important is every time we judge ourselves, and that's different from holding yourself accountable, you know, or taking responsibility for ourselves, right?
[00:51:21] Ruby Marez: There's a big difference. But when we shame ourselves, it does not help us nervous system wise. It does not help correct behavior in the long term. And every time you're judging yourself, you're basically taking a knife to your car tires and slashing it and the air is coming out and we want to pump air into our tire so it were a full tire.
[00:51:40] Ruby Marez: So that's one of the exercises I have people do. And I hope it has the same effectivity. For them as it does for me, you know, and the other one I will leave quickly because a lot of people do this one for anxiety, it's called the power pose, and you put your hands like this in the air, or if you want to have them as fists and do it for one minute, you know, you can do it before a date, job interview, because what it does, it lowers your cortisol stress levels and increases the feel good chemicals in your body because you're making your body big, right?
[00:52:13] Ruby Marez: So you're sending a message that they. I'm not being attacked. I'm not under threat. I've got this under control, you know, sometimes our body has to inform our brain many times. It's our body informing our brain. And so if we can do a physical movement like this, the power pose to make ourselves feel bigger.
[00:52:32] Ruby Marez: And for our listeners at home, I'm doing a V shape. With my arms up in the air and standing up tall. I'm sitting for the interview, but I would be standing up tall doing this for one minute. And that's an easy thing you can do in your car without that much thought to it. And people have told me many times that one has really helped them.
[00:52:53] Ruby Marez: So yeah.
[00:52:55] Charna Cassell: Thank you. Yeah.
[00:52:56] Ruby Marez: My pleasure.
[00:52:57] Charna Cassell: Totally. Such a great one.
[00:52:59] Ruby Marez: Thank you, Charla.
[00:53:01] Charna Cassell: You're so welcome
[00:53:02] Charna Cassell: . Thanks so much for joining us. If you appreciated this episode, please like, rate, review, and share it with your people. And if you want to stay connected, you can find me on Facebook. And Instagram at Laid Open Podcast, which is L A I D P O D C A S T, all one word. And if you go to charnacacell.
[00:53:24] Charna Cassell: com, you can join my newsletter where you'll get discounts as well as resources and be the first to know about my courses and events. At Passionate Life, you can read more about my approach to the work that I do. This has been Laid Open Podcast with your host Charna Cassell. We all have different capacities, but I believe in our capacity to grow and change together.
[00:53:44] Charna Cassell: Until next time.